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Friday, July 27, 2012

Update On Roosevelt Island Main Street Arcade Prototype - Windows Removed, Ceiling Wood Paneling, Light Fixtures, Signage Installed And Fresh Coat Of Paint - What Do You Think?

An update on Master Leaseholder Hudson Related's proposed mockup of the Roosevelt Island Main Street Arcade.

The ceiling wood paneling, lighting fixtures and signage have been installed as well as a fresh coat of paint applied to the walls and



can be compared to the current look a few feet away.


Here's view from across the street


and inside a store.


More on the Roosevelt Island Main Street arcade from previous post.

149 comments :

Cari Ellen O'Connor Bak said...

it is looking perkier, I just hope they keep it up and not let graffiti ruin it...

Rebecca Knell said...

Like the new ceiling and light fixtures but they need to keep the glass panels in. It gets brutal in the winter and it's needed for shelter. It's quite obvious the people who came to the decision to remove them all because "no one will be able to see the stores" doesn't live here. 

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Looks so much nicer. Classy not drab.

YetAnotherRIer said...

It looks so much better than the existing store fronts. I am looking forward to seeing this look throughout the Eastwood front and also along Westview. Let's see how long it will take for the usual complainers to add their comment.

YetAnotherRIer said...

I live here and I support the removal of the glass panels.

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Give it a minute, lol

bakgwailo said...

 I live here and I am not against the removal of the glass, and I am not sure if I really buy the argument that the glass makes anything better in the winter.

bakgwailo said...

Looks pretty nice, I like the wood. Have they thought of maybe adding a facade on the concrete posts (as opposed to just painting them), and perhaps redoing the concrete facade on the first level apartments? If done right, it could look really, really nice.

roozevelt said...

I live here and I like it better without the glass.  Hopefully, they will continue throughout the Roosevelt Landings side of the street, so it looks uniform.

Anonymous said...

I dont like it. There is no where to sit

Elle Erickson said...

Oh my goodness - that looks wonderful!
 

Anonymous said...

Nowhere to sit? Lol u live on an Island!! Go sit next to the water!!!

Anonymous said...

I like sitting in front so I can. B S. With everyone

Jesse Webster said...

I live here and am very pleased with the way this turned out, including (and especially) the removal of the glass. Would love to see the Z-bricks power washed or replaced with a different material.

CheshireKitty said...

The paint on the concrete is OK, the light fixtures are OK, and probably anything other than the panels on the ceiling would be OK.  Would I have selected wood paneling for the ceiling - not really.  It's a matter of taste, and wood paneling doesn't seem to me to match the style of the building.  

Removing the glass panels does afford a direct view into the store-fronts.  The question is, is giving up the benches worth the store-front view?  The benches were unique, does it make sense to give them up for a Subway restaurant, which is basically a dime-a-dozen proposition.   And, is the enhanced visibility really going to translate into increased sales?   You could have probably afforded better views into the arcade by replacing the existing glass with glare-free glass (just like most eyeglasses these days are glare-free).  

Was the trade-off of getting rid of the benches for the sake of increased sales the most responsible social path for RIOC/State of NY to take?  Or the most humane?

One thing that a commenter suggested on an earlier arcade-related thread though does make sense:  Since there are no stores in the two large glass-enclosed angle areas of the arcade, what is the point of removing the glass and bench units from those two areas?  Why not simply renovate those areas but let those benches remain?  Of course, like Demosthenes, I realize I'm simply shouting at the wind -- there is no way in hell, unfortunately, Hudson or RIOC is going to listen to any of us, no matter what we think.  So much for representative democracy on RI - so long to the wonderful Eastwood arcade window-benches.  

Westviewer said...

It looks nice -- much better than before.   I think there is a problem with the signage being hard to read, though.   There was no compelling reason to switch to a dark blue from a brighter, more legible red, which, additionally, is a color associated with Roosevelt Island  from the outset.  Think of the Tram.  Briefly, one of the operators decided to paint one care red and one care blue;  there was the usual RI hue and cry,  and the red was re-einstated and retained even when the trams were replaced in recent years.  

Mark Lyon said...

Actually, a bit of a redesign of the signs would carry over some of the old with a bit of updated new.  If the metal backing were taller (with at leas a few inch overlap at the top and bottom of the letters) it would echo the existing "strip" and provide good contrast for daytime use.  Might even be able to get away without using lighted letters and just use a contrasting metal color.

westviewgirl said...

the big shots at Related Properties I guess do not realize we are an ISLAND !!!~  When the snow and wind pelts the island in the winters  there will be tons of snow covereing the doors and sidewalks. What idiots!  The Store front owners shoulw call the big wig that thought of removing the glass when the blizzards hit and make him come with a shovel or snow plow and remove the snow from the store fronts. They are getting paid for making these ideas stick in writing, then they should be accountable when there is 3 feets of snow in front your business door and be made to remove it..also Related should have to storm proof the glass in these stores..the wind will cut like a knife in the winter through the cracks.

westviewgirl said...

there is valid points to some of the complaints..I like the upgrading ideas, but if either of you have tried to navigate the strees and sidewalks on main strees during some of the winters here, you would have a thing or two to say as well. It will cut down on food traffic if the sidewalks are 5 feet high of snow. 

westviewgirl said...

Mr Hoo, how about opening a BarBQ place in one of the store fronts, with a Juke Box and milkshakes and home cut fries? 

Frank Farance said...

Mr. Hoo, it's sad that you gripe about anyone who complains.  You and your establishment/partners griped a lot about issues that mattered to you ... IMO, some were unreasonable and/or self-serving, but I understood your business perspective and still took your business concerns as a legitimate perspective and I appreciate your point of view.

Your recent approach is to have a good number of posts that boarder on promoting your business via the blog: happy to engage discussion with customers promoting your business (poor response to customers who voice complaints?).

However, you are dismissive of others voicing their own concerns whose opinions differ from yours ... a good number of them with years more experience and factual knowledge that you have.

Should people return the favor to you: every time there is an article on the food trucks, should someone gratuitously post "Give it a minute [before Sal, et al, posts a response], lol"?  I don't think you'd like that.

Lastly, considering that you have a contractual relationship with H-R, maybe you can answer this question.  Some people have expressed concerns with RIOC Board member Dr. Ferrera of The Child School (now a tenant of H-R) and potential conflicts of interest in RIOC decisions related to H-R because he might promote H-R's perspective for his own gain.

I ask you the same question: When it comes to general issues, like H-R on Main Street Retail in this comment thread, why wouldn't we see you as a shill for H-R?  (shill: a person who publicizes or praises something or someone for reasons of self-interest, personal profit, or friendship or loyalty)

Looking forward to your answer, thanks.

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Frank you just seem to take exception with me on every point possible whenever possible, this comment is case and point. You write this whole post because i wrote "give it a minute, lol". Why should that get so under your skin? Are you identifying with the "usual complainers" YetAnotherRier was referring to? I think maybe you do. Why not take it up with her? 
       i don't know you all that well other than seeing you at RW from time to time and I'm not sure what your beef is but you seem to have an agenda to speak negatively on most everything and rarely positively on anything.      All I see you do is argue with everyone on this blog and most people don't seem to care for you and therefore attack you personally.  Not sure what you've done to upset them so much so that they just abuse you and call you boring repeatedly.      Let me explain something to you. I am going to defend my business when people have something negative to say because I am confident in the business we are doing and what we are doing for Roosevelt Island and it's residents. Legitimate complaints are heard and addressed. Trust me when you had your complaint I spoke with my kitchen about the issue.          I may use wit and humor to get my points across but you can't fault me for that. Does it bother you that when I do make my points, other people agree with me where you never seem to get any support?         I ignore some comments because,  quite frankly have you read some of the ridiculous statements made on this blog?  People attempt to twist something I've said to make me seem like I don't care about this community etc I'm not going to spin my wheels going back and forth with someone who is going to continue to answer irrationally.       Mr Lyons requested a burger be put back on special and through this blog he is getting it. I'm glad to be able to have an open line of communication with my customers here.       As far as  H-R  is concerned, I pay them rent every month. Besides that I have very little to do with them so I'm not sure why i would be a "shill" as you say. What would speaking on their behalf do for me? My rent isn't going down I can assure you.   I state my opinion and nothing more. In fact I spoke publicly against H-R on this blog in discussing the rent per sq/ft they were asking for the main street stores. If you don't remember, I said they aren't going to be able to keep businesses on main street open at the numbers they were asking for rent. 
      If you were really paying attention to what I say on here you would see I'm a active resident and small business owner who doesn't take life too seriously.I try to give my straightforward and honest opinion on the issues concerning our island through this blog. I apologize that it bugs you that I have a little fun while doing so.

CheshireKitty said...

Maybe he wanted to get away from the red concept/theme.  After all, NY is a blue state. ;-)

CheshireKitty said...

Sal is not a shill for H-R and he has a right to his opinion.  He's doing a good job at RW IMO!  Yet we need more pizza on RI - why not open a branch on Main St??  

We may or may not like the arcade rehab demo bay, but, like everything, Sal is right that we will get used to it (if the entire arcade is rehabbed the same way).  

Those that want the windows to stay should try to contact architectural historians perhaps, to see if the window features could be landmarked.  Unfortunately, the landmarking process takes time and time is not something that is available by now.  Otherwise, you can go the route of appealing to elected officials, although I wonder if that would have an effect at this late date.  The elected officials most involved in the decision - RIOC resident Board Members - have already gone along with what H-R is proposing.  

You wanted a Master Lease for Main St as promulgated by Kalkin - well, you got it, and now you will have no windows on Main St.  Let's hope stores do open and remain open in the empty store-fronts - otherwise, after the current exercise, you wont have windows to shelter you from the rain/snow, you wont have the comfy window-bench seating, and you still wont have stores.  (However, the arcade will have been rehabbed/updated..  I get a feeling that somewhere in there, the Child School is gonna expand into even more storefronts that do not manage to get leased.  What - that's already happened, at 504, Second Floor?  What a surprise!)  

Anyway, re the rehab scheme.  There are now some additional light fixtures installed - upward pointing ones, which illuminate the panels better.  The wood panels are not shellacked, thank goodness.  They are matte.  So, on balance, I'd have to say the panels are OK.  I still think some way could have been worked out to save/rehab the window-seats.  And I'm still not in favor of the "theme" benches proposed.  Even benches such as those at Southpoint Park would be better in that they'd be comfier.  But we have to first see a new bench in place before we can give an opinion on it... I imagine that will feature in the next phase of the demo bay.  

Frank Farance said...

Mr. Hoo, I suggest you carefully re-read my message, you said "you seem to take exception with me on every point whenever possible", but you missed what I said in the first paragraph "I understood your business perspective and still took your business
concerns as a legitimate perspective and I appreciate your point of view".

You say "you seem to have an agenda to speak negatively on most everything and rarely positively on anything".  Maybe you've missed the points recently where I spoke positively about public safety, or on the look of the wood paneling.  In short, I look contribute positively to the community by seeking to inform us (I'm not the only one).  My aesthetic is: I really don't like bullsh*t*.  (bulls sh*t: communications that are intended to persuade others, irrelevant of the truth/falsity of those statements)

Considering that there is a lot of BS, you'll see me sometimes on the Disagreeing Side in some arguments.

You say: "You write this whole post because i wrote "give it a minute, lol". Why
should that get so under your skin? Are you identifying with the "usual
complainers" YetAnotherRier was referring to? I think maybe you do. Why
not take it up with her?".

I think you have it backwards.  The focus is not upon agreement/disagreement with YetAnotherRIer, your statement in just a few words, is chiming in with the idea that we should diminish other commenters who disagree with you.  As a "active resident and small business owner", what was the purpose of your statement "Give it a minute, lol", if not that?

Regarding shilling, direct interests (your own rent) take higher priority than indirect interests (interests of your contract relationships), so complaining that H-R rents are too high is not inconsistent with a potential willingness to shill for H-R.  Maybe you'll clarify in future posts.

YetAnotherRIer said...

Because we Roosevelt Islanders a sissies and need glass panels to protect us from the elements. Somehow, this is how I would summarize the whole glass panel discussion. 

YetAnotherRIer said...

Frank, you are not any better than others. History showed that if you disagree with others and think you are right you won't let go. That's admirable to a point when it crosses into obnoxiousness and irritation. There are so many people that don't even want to talk about anything with you anymore because things go really, really bad.

YetAnotherRIer said...

Frank, try some humor once in a while. It'll make your life brighter and a lot more pleasurable. Maybe others would not take an issue with your persona either once you try it.

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Frank my point is simply this. On points regarding me and my businesses you choose to post when you have a negative experience but not post when you go down to Pier NYC and have a positive one (which I know you have).  Even Cheshire Kitty will throw a compliment around here and there when she feels like its deserving (thank you Kitty).
       In speaking to some of the elders on the island they have informed me that you will continue this back and forth as long as I will entertain you so let's agree to disagree and go on about our lives. I'll keep doing what I'm doing and you can continue to do what you do.

ktsenlee said...

I like the look of the ceiling and lamps. It’s an updated
modern nod to old fashioned hanging lamps, and the wood warms up the cold
concrete.


 


I believe that the glass panels should be returned with
some considerations.


 


If you are a parent with a child and are trying to cross the
street, wouldn’t it be safer for the cars to be able to see you as you approach
the curb? Not sure but heard this would be walled off completely. Hope that is not the case.



If you are one of our elder residents or with a disability,
wouldn’t it be better to be protected from the elements while still enjoying
the natural light.  For those who wait
for the shopping bus, the glass would continue to shelter as it has been in the
past in all kinds of weather. Climate change will have a profound affect on us all including the planning of our buildings.

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Sorry, I have enough on my plate already, lol

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

I do not own Nonno's Kitty

Frank Farance said...

Mr. Hoo, you're confused about the facts.  So I frequent the RW restaurant a couple times every week for the past couple years (regardless of my prior complaint).  I've been to Pier NYC several times.  My 10-year-old son liked it, so I told he to go up and personally tell Alphonse how much he liked the restaurant ... very Old School, and a right kind of thanks that meant a lot to Alphonse.  You've seen me point and recommend Pier NYC to people.

But none of that connects with you: you're upset because I haven't posted a recommendation on this blog, which sorta makes my point in the prior post: your posts seem more concerned with promoting yourself ... your FB page (click your link above) lists one item of recent activity: "Salvatore liked Pier NYC".

My sense is: the reason why we have these discussions is that you don't think two steps ahead, like in this argument ... if you had, you'd realize that I'm a longstanding and regular patron, so if you point out that I'm a regular patron and have positive experiences, then what?  Oh, the problem is that I'm not promoting your establishment on the web ... that's all that is lacking.  And that's the two steps that makes Frank 's point about your focus on promotion.

Just like our prior argument: you carefully watched the videos in slow motion, frame-by-frame, just for the Gotcha ... instead of children waiting for an hour for food, they only waited 45 minutes, i.e., instead of F- service, you've watched the videos to confirm you delivered F+ service.  If you really thought two steps ahead, you wouldn't have made that argument.  And the reason for the complaint was that RW staff and management were unresponsive.  I've ordered from Nonno's every week for years and had some complaints, but Alphonse was receptive.

You say "In speaking to some of the elders on the island they have informed me [blah blah blah]" sounding oh so officious.  Again, not thinking two moves ahead: so in this post you're willing to defer to others more experienced (the so-called Elders), but in other posts, you're your Own Man.  Which is it?

Frank Farance said...

YetAnotherRIer, I throw a little bit of humor into many of my posts.  Think of NYT columnist Gail Collins and her repeated references to Mitt Romney's dog strapped to the roof of the car.  (Yes, I'm no Gail Collins.)  We each have our own things we think is funny.  For me, I continually get a chuckle with Mr. Hoo's arguing that it wasn't F-minus service he was delivering, it was actually F-plus.  He spent a good deal of effort splitting hairs on F-plus vs. F-minus, which makes it even funnier.

So just for you, I've pointed out my comic contribution in my post to Mr. Hoo.

Frank Farance said...

YetAnotherRIer, when you're out of arguments to inform others, you deflect to something else. I recognize people have different opinions and I appreciate that.  Many of those so-called people who don't want to talk, most of them make that point for a rhetorical manipulation.  Just like you.

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Did you refer to yourself in the 3rd person in this post? Just checking.

Anonymous said...

I dont Know Why All THE excitement about pier nyc Its Not all That. I been There once AND once is enought

CheshireKitty said...

Hahahahaha!  True that!

CheshireKitty said...

That is a very interesting comment.  Climate change is supposed to make our climate much rainier in years to come because the moisture from the melting ice-caps will simply turn into additional humidity and rain.  Also, weather is supposed to get more extreme in years to come - we already have the seemingly unending thunderstorms, and even a tornado in Upstate NY, as well as the extremely destructive hurricane-like derecho that tore through Ohio, Penna. and the Mid-Atlantic states.   So the weather will be getting "worse" in terms of rain and storms and this is an additional argument why the windows should be perhaps re-envisioned and restored.  

I wrote elsewhere that they could be restored with non-glare glass/Plexiglas - with an appropriate reconfiguration of the vertical panes.  The elimination of the glare will make the store-fronts more visible.  The vertical panes could be done away with in favor of one sheet of glass or Plexiglas, or perhaps a multi-pane effect could be looked at - sort of in keeping with the cozy wood paneling, the hanging light fixtures.  Think how nice it would be if the same paneling could be applied to the benches themselves!  Then the arcade becomes even more livable and inviting - an extension of the businesses, a community extension of living space almost.  Something like that -- making those window-seats even nicer and updated, probably would be something that would be noted as a good update architecturally.   

CheshireKitty said...

Even though the winters seem to be getting less harsh, the Westview-Eastwood arcade was probably intended to provide a little extra protection for the seniors in Eastwood (since an entire building in Eastwood was built especially for seniors) and the disabled in all the WIRE buildings - I think RI was the first development built completely barrier-free.  The island also contained (and still contains) 2 large chronic care facilities so the idea was to give the disabled folks that might visit Main St a break -- a roof over the side-walk, and even some shelter from side-ways rain.  Someone would have to research if the semi-enclosed arcades were put in at the express direction of HUD, or were simply Sert's idea - to extend the line of Eastwood's bay windows into street-level window-seat bays.  

So the rationale for doing away with the windows is that the enhanced store-front visibility will lure businesses to open on Main St, and also lure shoppers.  I wonder if that will happen.. maybe?

The question is, did the businesses on Main St fail because of the windows?  The answer is no.  One by one, they failed primarily because of a lack of traffic, and even the new developments of Octagon and Southtown did not help.  They basically failed because most people preferred to shop in the City on their way home from work, rather than shopping on RI after they got off the tram/train - which is what usually happens in most neighborhoods (at least, this is what I used to do the many years I lived in an outer borough.  After work, I wouldn't shop in Manhattan and drag groceries to my apartment after having to travel something like 1 1/2 hr on several trains to get home; plus the prices in my part of town were much cheaper than Manhattan prices).  The City is only 1 stop away either by tram or train - so it is feasible to shop in Manhattan and bring food home to RI.  Yet the Farmer's Market succeeds - because it competes on quality if not price, but that is a whole other discussion.  Also, the distance from the tram/train to Manhattan Park or Octagon is not exactly walkable on a regular basis - so many commuters would simply get on the Red Bus and thus ride by Main St rather than walk up to Main St, shop,then continue walking to MP or Octagon.  So the businesses went into an endless spiral of not making enough money because of lack of traffic, then trying to save money by not updating, which made it less likely people would stop in (although I must say I still shop on Main St here and there, and some prices at some of the stores are competitive) and so on and so forth..  

Will removing the windows guarantee new businesses will succeed?  The answer is no.  It will depend on probably a slam-bang opening, maybe even with give-aways - to get people to at least try the products.  

So, it's a gamble with the rehab.  A rehab is OK, but let's not all delude ourselves into thinking that removing the windows will suddenly translate into a amazing increase in traffic.  The obstacles to that are formidable - and it will mean reshaping thousands of commuters/shoppers behavior so that they might walk up to Main St occasionally instead of riding right by on the Red Bus.  One thing that might make it more likely to increase traffic would be implementing a discount on the Red Bus to encourage people to hop on-hop ff the bus - so that if you show your receipt from a Main St business, you get to ride the bus for a dime.  If the bus were free, then you would not have the "issue" of people that live up-Island possibly not wanting to pay twice to get home from the train if they take the bus to Main St, shop, then take the bus up to Octagon/MP.  

I am sure 5 years from now, people are going to be talking about the windows.. that they did add something to Eastwood and Westiew, and that it's a shame that RIOC agreed to their destruction.   Let's hope there'll at least be a cafe on Main St in which to sit and discuss their loss..   

Frank Farance said...

Mr. Hoo, I suggest that you incorporate 4th/higher grade materials into your reading habits.  Then, you might be less confused and not mistake a third person reference with a ghost written piece.

See NYC Common Core reading standards,  "http://schools.nyc.gov/NR/rdonlyres/337BF93A-95FF-4A48-9434-CE9EA0B70E06/0/p12common_core_learning_standards_ela_final.pdf", page 21, Grade 4, item #6.

21).

CheshireKitty said...

People interested in the arcades - why they were put in - may wish to look at a study done on the UDC in 2004, which highlights Eastwood (in addition to Marcus Garvey Village in Brownsville, Brooklyn).  According to the report, Eastwood's "....three tallest buildings run north-south along Roosevelt Island’s narrow Main Street.  They provide a continuous covered arcade to protect residents in inclement weather and offer gathering places for social encounters."  Here is the website for the report 
http://www.udchousing.org/images/pdfs/exhibition/Part2_PolicyandDesignforHousing.pdf So providing gathering places for social encounters -- the window-seat bays within the covered arcade --was an intentional and perhaps key purpose of the arcade.  

siscoeb said...

 buy an umbrella and a hat. for winter guy some gloves

siscoeb said...

I think you are the champion of b.s.

siscoeb said...

 Frank take a nap your writing is similar to you knowledge-Boring

westviewgirl said...

when will PSD or NYpD or any thing stop the crowds of young and older men loitering outside at night smoking their drugs and selling the drugs almost everynight right across from the RIOC office and near the PSD office? It is almost like they do it in SPITE of the fact they should not be doing it. They are loud, rude and besides, that will not help anyone's place of business. 

NYCIslander said...

There are some who feel PSD shouldn't be wasting their time over a little noise, pot selling/smoking on the island, unless it becomes a major drug/crime issue. I don't share that view but I guess we can all agree to disagree on what quality of life areas PSD should be focusing on. Just curious but have you yourself ever called PSD to complain, I've called them twice for rowdy noise and people breaking bottles outside and they have always responded.

Amy Pippin said...

Frank I need more room so I'm going to respond here instead of below. I'm guessing that somewhere in that link there is some BS about ghostwriting but where I come from that's called speaking about yourself in the 3rd person and if i asked 100 people to read your comment they would all agree unless of course they are as smart as you.  And people who speak of themselves in the 3rd person where I come from have a name. Same name I give to people who have their bluetooth in even when they aren't in the car. 
        I hope it made you feel good to challenge my intelligence, because you certainly aren't going to win in a looks or personality contest.  I am starting to see why people don't care for you here. It's unfortunate. And I know you want to keep going but really, let's just agree to disagree. You're smart, I don't know the difference between speaking of yourself in the 3rd person and ghostwriting,  we're never going to see eye to eye.    

Amy Pippin said...

ii

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Frank I need more room so I'm going to respond here instead of below. I'm guessing that somewhere in that link there is some BS about ghostwriting but where I come from that's called speaking about yourself in the 3rd person and if i asked 100 people to read your comment they would all agree unless of course they are as smart as you.  And people who speak of themselves in the 3rd person where I come from have a name. Same name I give to people who have their bluetooth in even when they aren't in the car. 
        I hope it made you feel good to challenge my intelligence, because you certainly aren't going to win in a looks or personality contest.  I am starting to see why people don't care for you here. It's unfortunate. And I know you want to keep going but really, let's just agree to disagree. You're smart, I don't know the difference between speaking of yourself in the 3rd person and ghostwriting,  we're never going to see eye to eye.  Stop taking life so seriously. Loosen up a bit, maybe shave the mustache.

CheshireKitty said...

And you are the champion of pointlessness. 

CheshireKitty said...

The lack of nuance in written comments can lead to many misunderstandings regarding the writer's meaning.  The same problem has long plagued emails.  Also, the abbreviation LOL, which originally started as shorthand for laugh-out-loud as we all know, with no snark or sarcasm intended, now has become associated with mockery as opposed to a hearty, appreciative laugh-out-loud.  There is no way to distinguish tone of voice in written communication such as emails or blog posts.  I still use LOL to mean laugh-out-loud in a nice way, that is, that a comment or idea made me laugh, since I am not that "ironic" a person.  What Sal said, we'll get used to it - is of course true.  Like it or not, we'll get used to it.  The LOL that he added is just him making light of the issue, not mocking the residents.   Maybe you could interpret it as rueful/acceptance in fact.   Like we get used to being squashed in the subway, or we get used to our supervisor at work.  If you don't add some humor, rueful humor, then how can you cope with stuff like the subway crowding, or the impossible supervisor.  Of course you get used to the subway and the supervisor.  And of course you might say LOL.. because you are laughing philosophically in this case.  So I didn't take Sal's comment that way, as disrespectful, absolutely not - and I've spent alot of time criticizing some aspects of the rehab.  Let's not fight over rhetorical devices used in electronic communications and let's not personalize a discussion.  It's pointless and adds nothing to the discussion.  

YetAnotherRIer said...

You win.

YetAnotherRIer said...

Frank, you just don't get it.

YetAnotherRIer said...

You are a blast.

Westviewer said...

Can someone tell me what Frank Farance is babbling about?  Oh, never mind. 

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Seems to be  a popular question on the island.

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

No, no he doesn't.

siscoeb said...

Frank Farance is a good human being. I think if you ask him he well tell it is true. I usually see Mr. Farance walking on Main Street and at RIRA meetings.He is  always well dressed and punctual at all meetings. He wears his shoulders slumped because he carries all the problems of Roosevelt Island on his shoulders. Now that is my opinion and I may be wrong.Mr.Farance is very smart. I think if you ask him he will tell you it is so. When ever he writes and speaks he gets right to the point. I wish I could write as well as Mr. Farance . Mr.Farance keeps me healthy. Every time I read what he writes I fall asleep. M. Farance has done so much for Roosevelt Island that if we didn`t have him around many Island improvements would not exist.I`m sure if  you ask Mr. Farance he would agree.Every night when I pray to God I thank God for having Mr. Farance on Roosevelt Isant.

siscoeb said...

I agree.

Frank Farance said...

Siscoeb, you've mischaracterized me as being "well dressed" ... typically, I am not. :-)

YetAnotherRIer said...

*whoosh*

Jesse Webster said...

Might I suggest that next time Mr. Farance sets foot in RW, you have him cited for trespassing?

mpresident said...

Frank - you order a lot of take out. Maybe try cooking?

YetAnotherRIer said...

You took one sentence out of his entire posting (which, btw, he used as a rhetoric tool) and wrote paragraphs about it. How is this going to help your argument?

Frank Farance said...

YetAnotherRIer: I have addressed many of Mr. Hoo's points, I've (genuinely) wished him well, sprinkled humor (your suggestion), noted how the topic digressed, and suggested getting back on track to something of substance (acknowledging Westviewer's point).

Not only that, I accepted defeat (he can own the title "Prettiest Boy On Roosevelt Island"), and acknowledged his Prettiness.  In contrast, Mr. Hoo was critical of my looks.

I've accepted defeat on Mr. Hoo's arguments: you'll remember there was a dinner one night with children where I said the service was F-minus, and Mr. Hoo argued it was F-plus service, and Mr. Hoo was right: children waiting 45 minutes for a meal was F-plus service, not 60 minutes wait (i.e., F-minus service).

YetAnotherRIer, if I've conceded defeat (above), what more could  you (or Mr. Hoo) want?  And I continue to patronize the three restaurants several times a week.

Oh that's right, I forgot: Mr. Hoo wanted me to write a public promotion of his restaurant, and all I did (which was not enough) was patronize the restaurants regularly, have my son go up and thank one of the owner, and recommend people to his newest restaurant.

CheshireKitty said...

Memorable post IMO.  Frank's point that Sal uses the blog to promote his eateries, or that he's trying to "shape" in some way public opinion.  Sal does live on RI, and has a couple of successful businesses here.  Like anyone - resident or non-resident - he's entitled to post comments here.  It's refreshing that he does chose to communicate with the community via the blog.  Do any other "important" figures on RI do the same?  Such as Ms. Torres, Mr. Guerra, Mr. Kramer, Mr. Ferrera, or the Cornell RI team?  I see Sal as a pioneer of sorts, who has taken a chance on a relatively out-of-the-way place - and succeeded!  How can Sal not help commenting about his businesses?  I give Sal credit for trying to make himself accessible to the community - whether you agree or not with his comments, that accessibility alone is a plus.   

Frank Farance said...

ChesireKitty, my gripe was: Mr. Hoo was discouraging others from voicing opinions different from his own, which I still believe he does (independent of the LOL post you dissected).  Choosing to blab frequently or not it is Mr. Hoo's prerogative, my opinion is just my opinion, Mr. Hoo makes his own decisions.

As for pioneering this, I believe it was Mr. Shane (then RIOC President) and myself (then RIRA President) who provided regular posts/responses on this blog (2008-2010), well before RW had opened.  I note that Mr. Katz (current RIRA President) has refused to provide posts for the blog because he wants to support the WIRE over the blog.

Putting a more upscale restaurant in Southtown 4 with higher income tenants on top of an F-train stop, was a low-risk idea, as noted by Mr. Kramer, i.e., no one characterized it as "taken a chance on a relatively out-of-the-way place".

CheshireKitty said...

Many new restaurants - probably most of them - do not make it, no matter what neighborhood they are in.  It is risky to open any restaurant and RI lacks foot traffic even if it now does have the more upscale hi-rises at Southpoint.  Only Sal loses if his businesses fail - not H-R.  He pays 
rent to H-R - it's not a partnership.  Even so, why should be "attack" H-R?  Would you go on the blog with negative comments about Island House owner?  I doubt it.  Who knows what Sal thinks of H-R.. he may have made a skeptical comment about the suggested Main St commercial rents.  If Sal is doing OK on RI, why would he go out of his way to possibly alienate H-R?  All that could change if H-R doesn't hold up its end of the bargain.  Of course he's interested in making it on RI - which has to be one of the toughest areas to make it in, considering its isolation.  You may be right that Shane used the blog to communicate with residents via articles or interview postings although I can't remember actual comments by Shane on the blog.  

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Well Thank you Miss KItty.

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

If i'm not mistaken this "low risk" idea didn't exactly have people lining up to pour capital in the space at 425 as it sat vacant for some time. 
     And i can assure you it certainly was not a low risk idea as we struggled for the 1st 18 months so much so that we had to defer rent payments (that we are still paying back) to make sure we could keep our doors open. 
     It's easy for you to say that it was a low risk idea when none of your money was ever at risk. 
     And as far as "blabbing frequently" I think you have that one on lock down. At least my posts are witty and funny.

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Frank your man crush on me needs to stop. You are obsessed. Everyone continues to come to my defense on many points and yet you continue on and on and on and on. 
     You aren't funny, or witty, and its no fun if you are going to be this boring. Siscoeb may say some outrageous things on here but man is he on point about the boring. You really take it to a new level with quotes and boring links to boring websites that no one will look at. 
       Your attempt at humor is futile. You used a "NOT!" joke on an earlier post, I'm embarrassed for you. The year 1992 called, it  wants it's joke back. 
       I can say with full confidence that anyone reading this blog is getting great laughs from my posts and no one is enjoying yours. 
      I sat and spoke with some beautiful ladies who have been on this great island for many more years than I and they told me they get a kick out of my posts. We laughed and discussed how you just don't get it. So I will continue for their amusement if nothing else. 
      It's good for Rick's blog to have a  villain. You're kind of like the Penguin in Batman Returns. Except you have a mustache and he was a better dresser.

http://www.calsmodels.com/penguinreturns.htm

Now thats a link people will actually open and enjoy.

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Could not have said it better myself. Thank you for making the point about restaurants. 8 or 9 of 10 restaurants don't survive the 1st year. It's not the best place to invest your money and time with those odds.

NOtaserME said...

Frank, you are so right:) 

NOtaserME said...

You a very low human being. Frank is an amazingly smart person and you'll never beat that. Fast forward and you'll find yourself old and ugly. You are way less "handsome" than you think you are. AND the villain on this blog must be you.

NOtaserME said...

Mr.Hoo, since you state your looks are your forte and are putting others down based on their physical traits-ON A BLOG!!!-, why don't you start posting photos of yourself instead of making comments? Perhaps you should entertain your customers by dancing on the pole at THE PIER NYC??? It would be WAAY better than talking. 

NOtaserME said...

btw, from your profile image here, I have never seen you on Roosevelt Island, I can not recognize you. Perhaps you should update your image. 

NOtaserME said...

genius response!

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

YES!!! Oblovomama is back! Finally! Let the games begin.  Where have you been sweetheart? We've missed you dearly on the blog. Looking forward to some outrageous comments. And yes we have met and you were at the taser presentation. You had the demonstration done on you. If anyone missed it you can see the video on the blog. She tries to take a public vote on tasers right then and there , its beautiful. 

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

This is going to be great!! Frank and Oblovomama the dynamic duo of roosevelt island. Rick needs hits on here and this is a recipe for humor so let's get it going people.

NOtaserME said...

Seems like ms Guerra cut down on his request/proposalOn tasers. Let's see if this gets approved. The point is, his request is now a tinny tinny fraction of what his initial fantasy was and I consider that a victory.. Seems the vote was indeed beautiful, wasn't it? Still, I've never met you and in don't know who you are. Your fox 5 news tactics aren't really working. I peek in here once in a while and last night what was I here to see? A beauty contest. The slandering of a blogger's and father's physique. If you think comparing someone to the links you posted is not juvenile than you're insulting yourself. This is a blog on opinions not a pageant contest. I could care less what people behind their users names look like or who they are in real life. You're only here to promote your businesses and to poke fun at those criticizing them. Sorry, the food still sucks but I honestly wish it was good. You can keep pointing I'm the person in the taser presentation, I reeeeally don't care. I have never met you and have no desire to cross paths with you. Kitty and Frank make the best points here, they're actually thinking and you're quick to make fun of them. Perhaps you never left grade school.

bakgwailo said...

 Now we just need Morris back to complete the family.

CheshireKitty said...

Morris the cat?

bakgwailo said...

Lol, I just googled that, awesome.

CheshireKitty said...

"Us and Them" - thank you but this is silly IMO:  When has Sal overtly promoted his businesses?  He has answered questions about his restaurants, and responded quite forthrightly to any complaints.  It's refreshing to walk by RW and see it filled with people smiling and enjoying the ambiance, having drinks and food!  What's wrong with that?  He managed to pull off PierNYC too so he's a helluva guy in my book.  Actually it's great that he is available and open to feedback from customers. Does Kai do that?  That's with all due respect because I know Kai is an institution on RI who is strongly committed to continue his business here.  Everybody is entitled to their opinion but I still don't see that Sal is self-promoting in his comments.  

CheshireKitty said...

Silly.. the entire discussion is veering into irrelevancies and personalizations.  Why not try to stick to the original topic -- which was Frank's perception that Sal was more responsive to compliments than complaints about RW, and that he was somehow "associated" with H-R in regard to the arcade redesign.  First, there have been more kudos than pans re the restaurants - although there have been a number of negative comments here and there.  Any business owner would welcome customer feedback since he can then find out what needs to be improved.  I don't see that Sal has said anything out of line about the negative comments - the thought is he makes improvements based on the feedback.  He thanks those complimenting him - that isn't self-promotion, it's replying to a positive comment.  What would Frank have him do about the (few) negative comments?  I think Sal responds appropriately - maybe Sal's response is to make improvements that actually address the (few) complaints.  

Whatever Sal has said about the arcade redesign is his own opinion -  what would be the upside either way?  Is H-R going to give him or any other business leaseholder a discount on rent if they say nice things about the new arcade design?!  That is about as likely as snow falling in Central Park in the middle of August!! Sal likes the redesign - and he's entitled to his opinion.  

Of course I disagree with Sal on some aspects of  the redesign and have written numerous times about aspects of the arcade.  The blog gives all commenters a chance to voice their opinions etc. 

I have never said Sal is associated with H-R, although I do think other commenters may be "fronting" for H-R on the blog.  There may also be commenters that are employed by   RIOC/PSD on the blog that try to deflect negative comments about public safety, land or space allocation on RI, and other topics, using various techniques to defuse the blog's credibility, such as sisco and a couple of other ones.  

But, back to the arcade: As I've said before, having now seen the demo bay,I've concluded that the new design scheme is overall OK - although I would still try to find a way to upgrade/improve the window-seating rather than simply chuck it.  (Oh, BTW - unlike Westview, where the columns along the arcade are exactly the same width and thickness, the columns along Eastwood arcade vary in width here and there - removing the Eastwood arcade window-seats may make this variation in size more apparent and the resulting look may not be so pleasing.  Most colonnades have equal-size supports/columns I think - which makes for a pleasing row of evenly-spaced columns or supports.)  

Frank Farance said...

Mr. Hoo, just confirming: you're in arrears on the rent for 2-3 years, you have bad cash flow that makes that so. It sounds to me like you're the perfect shill for H-R because (quite literally) You Owe Them.

As for pouring capital into the place, everyone gets build-out in NYC, except when the space is really competitive.  So either someone else was also interested in the space, or you negotiated a poor lease and paid higher than you should have.

I recall Gristedes and some market (Amish?) turning down the space.  Maybe they were smarter than you in perceiving the costs as being to high (i.e., bad business, risk not worth rate of return), so they declined.

Other restaurants open quickly (to generate cash) and get their liquor license later.  You waited about 7 months to open *after*, maybe you were/are undercapitalized?

The reason why many restaurants go out of business is that it makes business sense: you're not getting the rate of return on your investment ... it can be a cold calculated decision.

In summary, it sounds like your cashflow is poor, you're undercapiatlized, your payable is high/aged, and you're getting a poor rate of return for the risk you have to take ... maybe not to different from other merchants on Main Street?

Now Mr. Kramer portrayed these merchants as low-risk, but I didn't know how poorly your business is doing.  Good Luck!

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Oh frank here we go again with long winded boring ass responses. You really may be the dullest man on the planet let alone Roosevelt island. Business at RW is great, when they cut our rent they spread out the difference over the next 5 years and that is the only reason we are still paying it off. For a guy who thinks of himself as being so intelligent you sure make many assumptions based on things said on here, stretch it and run with it. This is why you and Oblovaomamva are a match made in heaven although you are not her type.

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

You are right Kitty we have gotten off topic. Mostly because The Penguin's desire to continue on and on. His man crush on me seems to have no end and I must admit I am intrigued by his lack of a sense of humor, his  ability to lull people to sleep with his posts AND his super power which is getting people to dislike him. The stories that people come to me with daily about not liking this guy are endless. 
      I would love to stick to the topics but as long as he keeps up his boring retorts, I will continue to  have fun with him. See kitty because that's what this is for me, FUN. He's just low hanging fruit.  

westviewgirl said...

do not sweat what these old people in my part of the island have to say to you or about your place of biz ...they just want to change apartments with you :) class envy is how they see things, and are tired of their run down buildings. Yet, will not fill out an application for any of the South town apartments...wonder why? Enertia and wanting something for nothing...a cheap apartment in NYC! They are jealous of the beauty and the apartments in ST. Just fagetabout em~

westviewgirl said...

Mr Hoo, so you see how by provoking you into anger Frank and others that hate Hudson Related can get personal information out of you? It is a game, and you are playing with him. Just stop debating about things he has no business knowing anytways..how is his place of biz going?  Exactly!  He does not have one..

westviewgirl said...

Putting a more upscale restaurant in Southtown 4 with higher income tenants on top of an F-train stop, was a low-risk idea, as noted by Mr. Kramer...I am quoting you here Frank...you do relize that a LOT of southtown people are not ALL higher income people right? There are a lot of affordable housing apartments, and also renters ...not all people own their place nor want to. In fact, a lot of people that live in the wire buildings and north of blackwell house make a hell of a lot more money than most in SouthTown, but just want the stay in cheap housing so they can go on their African Safaris and their cruises and so forth. What is the idea that all southtown people are millionaires about? That is just aburd. South town is just new properties being built on land!  Do you see Trump living here? Anyone that continues to think that South town is where the Rich" people live are just idiots. 

Westviewer said...

It should be noted that there are income regulations  for the Northtown buildings.  In Westview, e.g., Income affidavits, accompanied by tax returns, are required  every year.  If the family income is above a certain level, a surcharge on the rent is applied for the following year, up to 50% of the base rent, bringing the rent close to level of the Southtown rental units.  I have no idea how many apartments are subject to the surcharge, but it should be obvious that Northtowners are not all "poor" and Southtowners are not all "rich."  I would go one step further and say that no Southtowners are rich by any normal (i.e., not Roosevelt Island-speak) definition of the word. 

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

Thanks for the comments Westviewer. I agree with you about the residents of South town not all being "the rich".              As for residents that live north of Blackwell and have lived here for years I find that many of them are amazing people who are happy,  fun and have a love for life. I have become friends with many long time residents so much so that they come to family events in brooklyn and I have gone to dinner with them off island. 
     As for Frank, I get a kick out of his knack for getting people to dislike him. I can't tell you how many "north island" residents have told me how funny they find this and how they dislike him,  with countless stories. Everyone is having a laugh about him both in South town as well as Northerners. I continue the conversation for a few reasons. #1. People get a kick out of it, as do I, # 2. My life is an open book and  I have no problem disclosing anything about it, and #3. I love this island and love being able to help the advancement of it.
      I know many people in this World are averse to change, my own mother is one of them. It doesn't make them bad people, they just lack the vision of a better future and potential. I can understand why they feel they way they do, but change is coming and you can either embrace it and see how it will improve life on the island OR you can fight it and stand by as everyone else spends the rest of their days happy, enjoying this great place.  

YetAnotherRIer said...

Right. I looked into the WIRE buildings a few years back and I am surprised, though, how high those income limits are. Isn't it in the mid 100-200k for a family with three kids or some such (that's for Westview)?

JimmyLaRoche said...

I know franks biggest accolade and pat on his own back was

JimmyLaRoche said...

Frank is a zero.

His biggest accomplishment on this island and biggest accolade was several years ago, we was going around with a digital camera photographing parking placards.

He was also photographing expiring muni meter receipts.

Big big accolades.

This only caused psd to grant no one any discretion and permission to park by the firemans field or the post office area. Which are oth low traffic areas with plenty of spots.

Tool.

JimmyLaRoche said...

Go back to the boonies in 2 river road.

What a zero.

I don't think pier NYC or any restaurant on the island accepts WIC, nor can you swipe the benefit card through the credit card machine.

Possibly in the future?

What do you say Sal?

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

I think those programs are in place for use at grocery stores where you can get more food for your family than you would dining out. 

westviewgirl said...

why are you after Mr Hoo so much and have you noise all up in his bee hive? His rent, and his return and profit is really none of your business now is it? I know you are friends with the Trellis and a lot of people think that Trellis is RW or the Peir's compo..but you know what? Trellis has not competition, on this island, they are in their own world, and anyone that eats at a place with that kitchen and that bathroom downstairs is making their own choice to do so...the prices are so over prices at Trellis it is just amazing they stay open. It is the die hard old timers that go there just to NOT go to the places to eat in ST. 

I used to eat at the Trellis all the time, then I started realizing how much they are bleeding the folks here with their high prices and lack of jus keeping th place cleaner is, well, kind of just being lazy. Some elbow greese is cheap and free.

westviewgirl said...

Dear Frank..There are children at the new South Point Park almost getting hit by cars as there are NO crosswalks painted at any intersections on roads and interesections leading down to the park on the eastside of the island behind Coler GW, or even at the park at the main entrance...people speed down that back road along with the 2 buses that go down the road as well...maybe if you would write a letter to RIOC they would do something about painting crosswalks going South, and paint one nice and bright at the park entrance, and maybe just put just as many down by the new park, and in front of the RI Hisotorical Society Kiosk in front of the tram also that are painted on the street in Northtown.  You cannot go one block without a stop sign or crosswalk. Why does North town get all the love with safety concerns, and all the bus stops? 

A child will be hit by a car or bus one day at one of the crossings, riding their bike, or walking over to the park, and THEN we all will ask why are there no crosswalks painted and speed limit signs posted and enforced. Thank you! 

westviewgirl said...

he really wears a mask :) 

westviewgirl said...

no, give him a beer and tell him to take a chill pill and stop being so darned serious and up tight, life is too short. god

westviewgirl said...

when our youth see that PSD and RIOC tolerate any drug selling at all on the island, they get the message that it is ok to buy, sell, smoke and do anything that is illegal. RIOC sure does not send good messages to the kids on this island by tolerating such things. PsD is afraid because most drug dealers usually are packing a knife or gun, and they do not want to get involved...so what is the answer here? Arrest them all, put them to work cleaning up the island to make them work off their crimes...clean out the dumspters and have them scrub the sidewalks, maybe they will get the message one day, nobody wants themn here. 

"Us and Them" said...

This is really pathetic. I originally came here for the discussion on tasers  and to my huge disappointment  am realizing  the food establishments I've been frequenting for years are in support of their use. My simple measure: boycott these establishments. I honestly do not know what you're referring to when you mention 2 river road, I do not live there, have never entered that building. I don't know what WIC is but have no idea why you're belittling and calling people using government programs "zero".    For example, people with disabilities get food stamps. These programs have been founded for a reason, some need them, some don't. Too bad your mind can't comprehend that a cashier at Target or wherever else would be unable to support their family through an honest job and might need outside help, i.e government programs. Others have made mistakes as young men, have been arrested for small infractions therefore unable to get college scholarships so they remain in the low end job market. . Perhaps you are unwilling to understand this though, because you are 1. 
Btw, tasers would never personally affect me or my family yet I believe that supporting their use would be to side up against my beloved community. 

"Us and Them" said...

And since when are we here to discuss posters' economic status? Also, I looked up WIC! It's a program for women to get baby formula, which by the way IS expensive. SHAME ON YOU for criticizing those who need it! You ARE BELOW ZERO!

"Us and Them" said...

Jimmy the ROACH!

YetAnotherRIer said...

You should read a bit more about WIC. It is not just about getting formula for babies. It's a food and nutrition program for women who are pregnant or have small children. Again, reading comprehension is not your strongest skill. Also, nobody attacked the WIC program. Another example of reading comprehension?

"Us and Them" said...

The problem with reading comprehension's yours: WIC helps women with children (as i'vealready stated) andJimmy LaRoche belittled people using these programs,calling them "zero"

"Us and Them" said...

Also, the posts are collapsing in a very strange way and I am having a hard time with the postings right now, I can not see what I've written

"Us and Them" said...

I never said anyone attacked the program itself but insulted peopleuseingthese programs.

RooseveltIslander said...

Sorry Us and Them about the problems with posting some comments. When there are more than 6 or 7 replies in a particular comment thread, Disqus has a problem with the indentations. I am aware of the problem and have been trying to find a solution. In the meantime, when you notice many replies to a particular comment that you want to respond to, the best thing to do is start another comment thread.

Again I am sorry about this and will have it fixed as soon as I can.

falk777 said...

CheshireKitty: Do you get free fries vouchers for your positive 'reviews' of those establishments??

falk777 said...

Well said Frank, Mr. Hoo LOVE talking about his fine establishments and self promoting endlessly. Not to mention the eye sore portable toilets they placed around the corner from  PierNYC. Can someone clarified with RIOC that PierNYC does indeed have the rights and permit to place portable toilets on that specific spot. Its selfish enough they make the entire promenade their own bullying ghetto; and now with portable toilets on public space for their PAYING customers!

Salvatore Anthony Hoo said...

2 words. Man Crush

Frank Farance said...

Westviewgirl, MINIMUM income is $300K for $1.4 million mortgage in 415 Main condo, assuming no other monthly costs/debt (according to FHA, see "http://www.fha.com/calculator_afford.cfm").

MINIMUM income is $250K for 2BR $4500/month rental in 405 Main (assumes 1/3 take-home pay goes to rent, typical for NYC).

MAXIMUM income for Island House / Westview is around $90-110K (varies based upon family/ apartment size).

I know there are some institutional apartments (tenants who pay/make less), but Southtown is mostly market rate housing.

Thus, for people who own apartments or rent at market rate in Southtown, they make at least 2.5 to 3 times more money.  Whether people are millionaires or not, I don't know.  But it is not possible to afford a $1.4 million mortgage in Southtown, based upon a $100K salary in Island House.

And, thus, having a more upscale (read: higher priced) restaurant in Southtown is lower risk because there are more potential customers with higher disposable income.

Frank Farance said...

Mr. LaRoche, you are confused about the facts.  In the WIRE buildings we have about 50 parking spots (less than a single block in Astoria/ LIC) for about 6000 people.  Back then it was impossible to get a parking spot to load/unload because there were many bogus placards consuming very few spots, which PSD ignored.

Bogus parking had the car in the same spot (unticketed) for weeks, months, and years.

My efforts led to proper signage and EVEN enforcement.

PSD is not prohibited from exercising discretion,  as I see every day there is someone temporarily parked (with PSD's permission) to quickly load/unload in areas that are normally restricted.

For the 30-60 cars that abused the privilege, I spoiled your fun.  Were you one of them?  Meanwhile, 10,000 other residents were very appreciative.

Mr. LaRoche, I would have expected you supporting fair and evenhanded law enforcement.

JimmyLaRoche said...

Sir, there were way more pressing concerns than tickets and parking at the time.

Your only goal was to make a name for yourself because at the time, transportation alternatives made this a hot topic with nypd.

I did not care as I at the time had a motorgate spot. The area with the placards created a lot of annomisty between psd and other law enforcement and civilian people due to your making a name for yourself.

Do you know what everyone was saying when they saw you? It wasn't pleasant.

I know because I had a few friends "in the know" at the time.

I am not calling you a bad guy, just learn that it's a small island and it's very very easy to make people upset. Not a good thing or healthy for anyone.

CheshireKitty said...

Us - You say to keep to the topic and not personalizediscussions, but you do that with Sal.  This thread was originally about the arcade - not a personalityor beauty contest.  Also, you don't like the food at RW - fine - don't eat there.  Nobody's forcing you to dine anywhere. I agree that LaRoche was insulting you by trying to associate you with the Section 8 building of MP - 2RR.  And casting aspersions on your financial status by implying that you qualify for SNAP (food stamps) i.e. that you're very low-income.  So both of you are veering  off topic and into personal insults instead of keeping to the topic.  

CheshireKitty said...

Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha... notice that I've never actually reviewed either of Sal's places!  I've merely lauded Sal for pulling off two successful businesses on RI - that adds something to my life (oddly enough perhaps) to see people enjoying themselves, it's an up.  RI is less "gloomy" with these restaurants!

CheshireKitty said...

I do not think that a lot of Southtown (ST) people are low income people.  Some - very few really - apartments there were set aside for low income - and some were rented with Section 8 vouchers.  This was via the Lotto program.  The developer claims the hospital housing counts as "affordable" because the hospitals subsidize the apartments for staff housing.  So they say.  

Re: Northtown (NT). Yes - there is no income limit for the LAP program in Eastwood - and some LAP people may be "rich" I suppose.  But the vast majority of folks in Eastwood are not rich - they can't possibly be rich to qualify for Section 8 assistance.  2RR = Section 8 100%.  The west side of NT is a mix - but I wouldn't say that population beats out ST in income.  MP and Octagon is market rate - whoever is in there is obviously in a position to come up with the fairly expensive rents being charged.  

The big difference with ST is the luxury condo building (as opposed to the up until very recently Mitchell-Lama coop of Rivercross).  The construction of that 1 ST building represented a quantum leap in property value or value commanded by properties on RI, with the sale of million-dollar condos.  So, yes - some of the folks in that building must be alot richer than most of the rest of us.  They either got jumbo mortgages and thus must earn big bucks to keep paying month after month on those loans, or they had a sizable pile of dough to make a substantial down payment on a million-dollar apartment.  Either way, you can't be poor to own a million-dollar apartment in ST, which is the only place these kinds of apartments are found on RI. 

If Northtowners - those that are more well off - thought these ST properties were such a great deal, you would have seen a migration to the new construction of ST.  Didn't happen.  The more well-off in NT preferred to stay in NT - as "rundown" or "70s" as it is - since it's a way better deal than pouring dinario into Kramer's (or some bank's) trembling grasp month after month... 

CheshireKitty said...

Frank is right. Main St is supposed to be available for parking for all - or quickly loading andunloading.  Somewere "hogging"scarcespots. This was an issue that would have been tailor-made for an investigative WIRE report - instead it was up to Frank to be the"investigative"reporter, which didbring needed changeto Main St parking enforcement.  

CheshireKitty said...

This is replying to Jimmy's vaguely ominous reply to Frank regarding the placard issue of several years ago.  Those in the know, those that may have been affected by having the placard privileges revoked: Who could those be?  Let's see - RIOC personnel?  Other state/City agencies?  So, because someone is a State of City official, they get to hog scarce spaces on RI.  This is your thinking evidently.  My thinking is: Let the dam' State or City agencies issue a parking voucher or reimburse for parking at Motorgate!  The State or City of NY can't pay for parking for an official or employee?  I doubt it.  This is a non-issue, Jimmy - Main St wasn't designed for long-term parking, period.  It isn't as convenient to park in Motorgate, that is true, but them's the breaks.  There is in fact a greater availability of spots on Main St whereas several years ago I had basically given up on trying to find a spot to unload groceries at my building.  So, thank you Frank!  Thank you very much! 

CheshireKitty said...

Weall gotta play by thesamerules,pal.  Youareadvocating a specialsetof rules for who?  Thosein theknow? And who mightthose be? 

CheshireKitty said...

Can it Jimmy - time to returnto thecornerbarfor a drink.Nobody gives a s--t that youcanno longerillegally park andgetaway with it.  

CheshireKitty said...

This is silly.  No Southtowners are rich... what is that supposed to mean?  What a ridiculous comment.  

CheshireKitty said...

I never have a problem going into a barandusing thebathroom.  This is a long-standing tradition.I'm sure anyonewould be welcometo usethose Porta-potties.  

"Us and Them" said...

I just wrote a long post and erased it. I'm disgusted by what's being said here. All in all, I have suddenly decided to leave this board. Roach's philosophy that women on WIC do not have a right to opinion is revolting. Hoo's bullying one of his customers based on his looks is not only outrageous but sad, pathetic and denoting a very simplistic mind. Kitty's post are quite enjoyable. Rick is the best! I think that's it.
Signed,
NOTASERME, Gun control and Universal Healthcare for all!!!!

"Us and Them" said...

I'm starting to think so....

"Us and Them" said...

Kai is taking the high road, Kitty. There are certain things you don't know.

"Us and Them" said...

Just wow at your ignorance and fear....

"Us and Them" said...

Accomplishments also happen behind closeD doors, how would you know what Frank's accomplishments are? What's ANNOMISTY by the way, you mentioned this word in two posts already. Frank is certainly a more accomplished writer than you are according to Lady ANNOMISTY.

"Us and Them" said...

Class? LMAO!!!!

"Us and Them" said...

Thanks R! Thought it was my browser. No worries

"Us and Them" said...

Look up Sophie Calle! She is an amazing artist and conceptual photographer. Unknowingly, Frank was making an art work, a very contemporary piece the highly educated never cease to recognize.

Westviewer said...

I specified that they are not rich except in Roosevelt Island-speak, i.e., by R.I standards.   Why would anyone really rich live here when they could have a loft in Tribeca, a penthouse of Fifth Avenue, a house in Greenwich, etc., etc., etc.  A little perspective, please. 

Frank Farance said...

Westviewgirl, I drove around to get a better sense of your concern.  South of the tram, there are 6 crosswalks, 3 on each side at the intersections.  The promenades are the main walking paths south of the bridge.  On the east side *for children* (not hospital employees) it doesn't make sense to cross to the "inner island" of Goldwater because you're walking through parking lots and loading zones.  In fact, I wouldn't want children (or animals) walking through all that dumpster juice.

With the new bus stop at Southpoint park, I think we need a painted crosswalk there.  Although you want a crosswalk, I'm not sure that solves the real/ hidden need in your concern.  Why?  Drivers have the responsibility to stop for pedestrians when they are crossing, crosswalk or not.  A crosswalk can provide a clear area for people to cross (i.e., no parking in a cross walk), but since there is no parking around Southpoint Park, a crosswalk has little effect.

What we really need is a stop sign or two (which also addresses your concern about drivers' speed).  In my opinion, the first one should be a the east gate of Southpoint (with two crosswalks: one E-W at the stop, one N-S to the right (west) side of the east gate.  The second stop sign should be at the west gate at the bus stop, again two crosswalks.

RIRA President Matt Katz, RIRA Island Services Committee Chair Aaron Hamburger, and myself as RIRA Planning Committee Chair regularly meeting with RIOC staff to discuss these kinds of things, and RIOC has access to traffic engineers for review.  I will mention it to them and the members of the RIOC Board Operations Committee.  Thanks for the good suggestion, let me know if you have other good ideas/ concerns.

YetAnotherRIer said...

You must have a huge chip on your shoulder to read so much into a comment.

Jesse Webster said...

We're nottheonly ones who think Frank is fullof hotair.
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20091117/0835176963.shtml 

Frank Farance said...

Jesse Webster, nice article about me, but you missed the actual testimony: I did prove Google statements were wrong that lawsuit.  No hot air at all!  And it was similar to things here on Roosevelt Island: taking a truthful stand regardless of fierce conventional/ popular opinions.  Yes, this is how real science gets done.

YetAnotherRIer said...

I read the affidavit (http://www.citizen.org/documents/Jenzabar%20-%20Affidavit%20of%20Frank%20Farance.pdf) and you didn't prove anything. You had an opinion and argued it. Google and many others disagreed with you. I also found a few amusing postings on some of the IEEE mailing lists where you argue your points with very little consideration of other opinions. There is a pattern.

YetAnotherRIer said...

Yup. A pattern.

Frank Farance said...

 YetAnotherRIer, you're looking at the wrong document, there was another document that detailed a controlled experiment, which proved Google's statements were wrong (i.e., metatags can affect search ranking).

Hmm, you say I was on the wrong side. Google is telling people wrong information about their search algorithm, so many many businesses spend money aimlessly on web ads and Search Engine Optimization.  And I provided truth and clarity, there's a lot of BS on the internet (regardless of how popular it is).

Maybe you should understand why my affidavit was posted by *Opposing Counsel* and why this litigation was discussed in on-line: they were trying to crowd-source an answer to prove me wrong, but they didn't find anyone (of course) because the experiment proved my statement.

YetAnotherRIer, let's make this fair: let's know who you are, so we can explore you background (as a digression for topics about the Island).  Ditto for you too Jesse Webster.

YetAnotherRIer said...

"there was another document that detailed a controlled experiment, which proved Google's statements were wrong"

I was able to find the affidavit as well. You claim that the addition of a meta tag alone was the reason why the search result was different in your experiment. How can you make such claim? There are a ton of other parameters that go into Google's search ranking that you will never be able to control in a way to come to a solid conclusion, as you claimed you did.

I also read the defendant's motion to strike your affidavit (I think I am having way too much time on my hands to actually do all this) which they call a "fraud". I can see where they are coming from. You seem to rely way too much on your credentials 

"they were trying to crowd-source an answer to prove me wrong, but they didn't find anyone (of course) because the experiment proved my statement."

But you didn't. The defendant won the case in the end and Google and most other SEO "experts" never agreed with your findings. And rightly so, you were never able to prove your claim convincingly.

"let's know who you are, so we can explore you background"

You really think everybody's background is important here? Not in this case.

CheshireKitty said...

Not worth it to argue this point, "Us".. since it's so ridiculous. Nobody is ever "envious" of exploitative, larcenous rent, even if they can afford it.  

RooseveltIslander said...

I think it is time to close this thread. We have gotten way beyond the topic of the Main Street Arcade for much too long. 

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