No Explanation On What Killed Roosevelt Island Squirrels - RIOC Says Testing Found No Toxins At Riverwalk Lawn Area Between 455 - 465 Main Street, So What Happened?
Image of FDNY Testing Unknown Substance Last Sunday Night
Reported last Sunday on the three dead squirrels and unknown substance found at the Roosevelt Island Riverwalk Buildings lawn between 455 and 465 Main Street.
Image Of FDNY Investigating Roosevelt Island Dead Squirrels Last Sunday Night
On Monday, I asked Hudson Related's David Kramer:
Last night several dead squirrels were found on the lawn facing Manhattan between Riverwalk Buildings 455 and 465 Main Street. There was also an unknown grain substance found on the lawn.Mr. Kramer looked into the matter and replied:
FDNY Hazardous Material Squad, NYPD and OEM responded. FDNY conducted tests on the substance and we are waiting for the final results.
Here is more info from last night's post on subject.
Does Hudson Related maintain the grounds and if so, have any new pesticides, fertilizers or other product been used on the lawn?
our property management has no knowledge of what the substance is, how it came to be on our lawn, and we haven’t changed anything in terms of maintaining the grounds...On Monday I also asked the Roosevelt Island Operating Corp (RIOC) President Leslie Torres and Vice President of Operations Fernando Martinez:
Any comment from RIOC on last night's FDNY and NYPD Hazardous Material Investigation of substance found on lawn between 455 and 465 Main Street.Yesterday, RIOC issued the following advisory:
Several squirrels were found dead on the lawn last night and the FDNY/NYPD were investigating a white grain substance found on the lawn.
Was RIOC using any pesticide in that area recently?
After a 911 call was made by a resident on Saturday, July 22, 2012 regarding potential toxins near West Drive, FDNY, the Office of Emergency Management (OEM) and the Department of Environmental Protection (DEP) sent responders to the island. All 3 government agencies tested the site for toxins. None were found. The responding city agencies, consequently, deemed the area safe and reopened the west roadway. The FDNY was the lead agency at the scene, and should be contacted directly for any further questions.Roosevelt Island resident Raye Schwartz responds to RIOC's advisory:
Sincerely,
Roosevelt Island Operating Corp Advisories Group
This response is nonsense and misleading. Several very dead squirrels suddenly appeared on that lawn and that's why the 911 call was placed, not just to find out if there were toxins!More info from last Sunday's post.
The call was placed to find out why several dead squirrels were suddenly discovered Sunday afternoon on the lawn behind 465 Main Street, and the search for toxins, particularly rodenticides, was part of that question. That no toxins were found in that location doesn't mean that they were not purposely fed to the animals elsewhere and carried back to the animals' habitats. Telling residents to contact FDNY is 1) passing the buck, and 2) misleading without a contact number for the agency you are telling us to contact with further questions! That's your job, and if you don't want to do it, give us back the tax money we pay for your salaries!
Obviously several squirrels at a time did not suddenly die of natural causes. Once again RIOC is shirking responsibility by failing to educate residents and visitors about why they should not feed stray animals or pigeons, and placing signs all over the island is part of that process. Public Safety officers won't do anything to stop the careless pigeon feeding or dropping trash, claiming it's not their job because they work for the state...or is it that they are just eagerly awaiting their new taser toys!
Perhaps one or more people who were annoyed by these animal pests took matters into their own hands. All the strum und drum of firetrucks and police won't hide the fact that such irresponsibility on the part of RIOC led to the death of a dog last year when it swallowed rat poison. That poison would not have been needed if a prevention program was in place.
Will it take the inadvertent death of a child accidentally ingesting animal poisons placed by uncertified maintenance staff or fed up residents, rather than by licensed animal control specialists, to wake you up to the fact that such chemicals are not "safe for children and pets"? What will it take to get RIOC to implement a program of prevention so that no hazardous chemicals are needed to control the pigeon and rodent population on this island?
The 911 call was placed because of dead squirrels, not because there were toxins, and there is no answer about why these squirrels died. Did any of you bother to ask about whether FDNY had any idea about what happened to those creatures?
Shame, shame on RIOC for such an inane (non)advisory!
24 comments :
Jesus H Christ. Two squirrels were found dead. Two. It is more fun to call it "several squirrels", of course. Two squirrels. First time ever. Let's call the FBI? Maybe the CIA or NSA? Let's keep those away until something similar happens again in the near future. Right now, all facts point to this being a freak incident. That's it. Why all this fuzz over a couple (a pair) of dead animals? Maybe it was a crazy person having some "fun" with them but who knows and in the big picture of things why does it matter so much?
Raye Schwartz is a CHRONIC COMPLAINER. She complains about everything from stuff at Rivercross to RIOC to Restaurants. I have never heard the woman say anything nice about ANYTHING to ANYONE.
I guess none of "our" squirrels have ever died before.
Her complaints make sense. The is no praise in the issues she is undertaking which is probably why it seems she is perpetually complaining. Because no news is good news.
YetAnotherRIer, you illustrate the poor, irresponsible thinking that is so common today in this country. Rather than seeing it as a warning and thinking how to anticipate problems to come, your focus is to minimize the warning, to be dismissive, and to joke.
God forbid a child touched poison, put their hand in their mouth, and died.
Rather than tease out the essence of the problem (which I hope you can see), you focus on Ms. Schwartz' cranky presentation (I agree she can be cranky at times) and, thus, you turn off your Listening Ears an we all get a comment post from you that's like hers: cranky and uninformative.
I was there, I was speaking to all the people at the time. It was the opinion of FDNY that there might be some hazardous material in the vicinity of the dead squirrels. It was FDNY who called for HazMat.
As for RIOC's advisory, it seemed to make sense to me (now). I listened to Rick talk to the responders at the scene, he asked about the "lead agency", which it turns out is where the follow-up information will be. I didn't know that at the time (because I'm not a journalist/reporter), so I learned something, too.
In other words (Ms. Schwartz), call FDNY for followup (not, say, NYPD or OEM who were also at the incident). And if you (Ms. Schwartz) don't know the number, since it isn't an emergency, call 311 and they will get you connected.
It wasn't two squirrels, it was at least three; at least two were piled up inside the tree.
The reason why this deserves attention is that they all died of unnatural causes. I am waiting for the report on the cause of their death.
I reiterate my main point: this should be a warning, and I hope something worse does not happen.
I cannot take the death of two (three? see, how we all make guesses and adjust those guesses towards how we approach incidents like these?) as a sign of something serious. Could a child put her hand into poison and die? Of course. Could it be preventable? Probably not, depending on who is watching the child. Stuff happens. And I say this as a parent, by the way. Give me another "mass extinction" (gotta love this rhetoric) of squirrels and we can talk again. Until then... happy blowing things out of proportions.
YetAnotherRIer, according to you, if a child dies playing on a lawn with toxins, then "Stuff Happens" and we should accept that: "Could it be preventable? Probably not.".
A responsible person might think: let's find the cause of death, and (if of unnatural causes) let's understand what can be done to prevent that. FDNY, HazMat, and NYPD all take it seriously and don't see this as being blown out of proportion ... for them, a child dying is not acceptable, i.e., they disagree with your Stuff Happens.
In your zeal to trash Ms. Schwartz' complaint, you've painted yourself into a corner of irresponsibility. Realizing this, you rationalize your position with "Stuff Happens". You've vaccinated yourself with "and I say this as a parent", but no (other) parent would want to entrust their children to your care with an attitude like that.
God forbid your child had been poisoned. I doubt your reaction would have been "Stuff Happens" and any attempt to investigate and prevent future deaths you'd tamp down with "you're blowing it all out of proportion".
Listen, it comes down to one very simple idea: the death of two (or three squirrels) does not make me start worrying about the safety of my children or anybody else or their respective pets. That's why I think your and Ms Schwartz's reaction is out of proportion. My very own opinion. You can blast me for that, help yourself, but since I have been following your actions and reactions ever since you were RIRA president your way of dealing with things doesn't make any impression on me. Sorry.
YetAnotherRIer, too bad you choose not to inform yourself. And too bad you simply dismiss things because you don't like the person (e.g., Ms. Schwartz).
Uh, let's see: some of the things I made a fuss over as RIRA President:
(1) Long-term finances for RIOC budget. Was 5-year projection (insufficient), when I became RIRA President I griped, and now RIOC regularly gives a 15-year projection ... financial information that gives residents a much better understand of RIOC's financial strengths and weaknesses, e.g., dependence on Southtown 7-9.
(2) RIOC elections 2010. Me: Exposed the manipulation by MTG and their ties in cancelling 2010 election. Katz: won the RIRA 2010 election on this point, but later lost it all for the community because the Governor appointed someone else (we had no candidates because we had no 2010 election), and the Governor is listening to us less because we've shown (thanks to Katz, Margie Smith, and MTG) that the residents manipulate the RIOC election process for us residents' own purposes, such as privatization.
(3) Blackwell Park Committee. Me: Got resident involvement in a process that RIOC was trying to do all by themselves.
(4) Monthly RIOC Board members meeting with residents. Me: Got RIOC board/staff to meet with residents the night before RIOC board meetings to explain/discuss agenda items and other resident concerns. Katz: In two years, he has arranged ONE meeting, and has diminished the communication among RIOC and the residents.
(5) Improved PSD's relationship to the community after parent arrested at baseball game. Me: Held town hall meeting, worked with PSD/RIOC on better response to community's concerns.
(6) Improved Red Bus Service. Me: Worked with RIOC (and Katz and Hamburger) to get the service running regularly.
I'm sure there were many others, but those come quickly to mind. And they were things that other RIRA Presidents had tried, but failed. They all required lots of public complaining, and all (with the exception of #2) had substantial benefit to the community. For #2, I didn't get RIOC 2010 elections, and look at all the problems since.
Too bad none of that made an impression upon you.
Try taking a nap.You make no sense at all.
When you were president of RIRA everyone at the meetings fell asleep because you never stopped yapping.That`s why you lost to Mr.Katz in 2010. Try taking a nap instead of yapping all the time. If you become President of RIRA again I will attend all the meetings any time I have a hard time sleeping.zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
I think your message was a little too short.Try writing with a little more substance. I`m falling asleep. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
I don't know Ms. Schwartz in person, so I have no idea who she is and have absolutely nothing against her. It's how she presents herself is off-putting.
The same with you, Frank. I know you have done a few great things (personally, I thank you for the work you have done to expose the MTG). But you did quite a few things that were a big turn-off and were mostly responsible for your loss in the last RIRA election. The one that sticks in my mind the most is the baseball incident with "blue beard" and how you acted and reacted in the aftermath. And then there was this whole rhetoric about RIOC's debts and how you think we are in big trouble (so much noise for really no substance in the end). Those, for me, were two deciding factors why I just cannot take any of your arguments seriously. It is too much noise.
Disclosure: I did want to see you win in the last RIRA election but not because you are qualified, IMHO, but because you are a riot and the RIRA needs somebody like you so it would destroy itself from the inside out and can be replaced with something functional.
YetAnotherRIer, Delightful Dainty Doily Wishful Suggestions weren't the right approach on the Blue Beard issue with PSD ... PSD was not listening to the residents at that point. The problem
got out of hand with Blue Beard, several residents reported prior problems with PSD, and the
end result was that PSD/RIOC came to the table with RIRA to look towards
are cooperative solution. Delightful Dainty Doily Wishful Suggestions would have gone nowhere -- and got nowhere with PSD for many residents for many years. The outcome since that Summer 2009 PSD Town Hall meeting was better for
the community: PSD and the community have a much better relationship since then. I'm certain Chief Guerra and Mr. Martinez would say that that meeting with the community was an important step towards a better relationship.
You'll find the billion dollar issue is now disclosed in
this year's RIOC audited financials, i.e., RIOC and their auditors believe it is real. And there is still more to come on this issue.
Ultimately, you did get what you wished for: Mr. Katz' leadership has done a nice job of minimizing RIRA's influence in the Governor's office, and for Cornell. RIOC Board Members like Margie Smith helped, too, such as the idiotic RIOC legislation that she lobbied for while she was a RIOC Board member at the same time ... the Gift That Keeps On Giving (in a negative way) to residents.
I wished there were a better outcome for RIRA, but We Get The Government We Deserve.
What idiotic legislation? For the revision for the board to be more opem with the community?
Thats all that is written.
Is it possible some jerk dumped some harmful substance in the tree - knowing that kids/pets would never go there but squirrels would? Did the police/FD check in the tree itself? Also, the squirrels were checked for toxins, but there may be substances that are not toxic per se (i.e. would not come up in a tox screen test) but are harmful to certain animals, that may have been placed in the tree to harm/destroy the squirrels. Were necropsies done on the squirrels to determine the cause of death? It is highly unlikely that all 3 squirrels died at exactly the same time in the vicinity of the tree purely by chance. They must have ingested a substance that killed them - perhaps not a substance that is toxic otherwise, but one that would harm them. For example, I think there are certain human foods pet owners are never, ever supposed to feed to pets; it's probable that the same applies to squirrels. Certain otherwise harmless substances that may be harmful to wildlife may have been placed into the tree to harm the squirrels. If this is found to be the case, it really should be investigated since it certainly represents deliberate harassment and harming of wildlife, which, even the lowly squirrel, as much as we may dismiss them, are still wildlife and as such protected from harassment/harm by law.
There's one other possibility of what may have happened to the squirrels. The squirrels that "lived" in Southpoint lawn were getting handouts from passersby, possibly also from patrons at the Starbucks, which abuts the lawn. It's possible that someone inadvertently fed the squirrels a substance that is harmless to humans but which may cause harm to squirrels. I can't say what it might have been as I'm not a vet or know that much about squirrel physiology. It could be they were fed a food/treat that would never harm a human but might cause a squirrel's physiology/electrolytes /what have you to go seriously awry. Perhaps they ate too much salt all at once, maybe in the form of chips? Squirrels must only weigh a few ounces - so eating a large amount of salt all at once might be quite harmful or even deadly. I'm just guessing, but it's possible there may be a variety of foods that are harmless to humans but which might harm/kill a small animal like a squirrel.
Katz has gone a long way in doing that, YetAnother. You thought Frank was a "riot" as RIRA Pres? Look at Katz and the numerous near-riots that have occurred during his presidency?Any surprise that so many Councilmembers have quit in disgust? Yeah, it'd be nice to "have it replaced with something functional". Any suggestions?
Here's a link to the ASPCA list of common human foods that are harmful to pets. And, yep - salt, in the form of salty foods like chips, is the last entry on the list.
http://www.aspca.org/pet-care/poison-control/people-foods.aspx
CheshireKitty, YetAnotherRIer is Aggressively Ignorant and proud of it. "Stupidity, Like Virtue, Is Its Own Reward". So even if YetAnotherRIer doesn't see a warning with animals dying, YetAnotheRIer wants to stand in the way of others investigating potential safety issues. (Note: it was **FDNY** that thought it was worthwhile to bring in Hazmat, not the resident who complained initially, nor Ms. Schwartz.)
If YetAnotherRier were merely Ignorant, he/she would let the process move along, not helping nor hindering.
But an Aggressively Ignorant person thinks a realistic / constructive idea is: "RIRA needs somebody like you so it would destroy itself from the inside out and can be replaced with something functional" and that being a "riot" is an essential quality of a RIRA President.
CheshireKitty, that is why I said: We Get The Government We Deserve. Many of us try to inform the community (we have a diversity of opinions), but if the community doesn't want to be informed, there isn't much we can do about it ... we're left to our individual efforts.
I look forward to YetAnotherRIer's ideas on "something functional" for replacing RIRA, but I don't expect a constructive response because it is easier to complain irresponsibly than it is to put forward a constructive proposal in which one seeks consensus (really, the latter is much much harder).
Whether it's some mass murder whose community didn't take warning signs with lots of dead animals until he got the courage to take on humans, or it is an institution like Penn State whose abusiveness went on for years (with heads turned the other direction, in a similar way as YetAnotherRIer attributes to "freak accidents"), the same lesson still must be learned: pay attention, act responsibly.
And if it turns our that the squirrels died of natural causes, then that is a good outcome (well, not for the squirrels) because we (FDNY, etc.) had a hunch and it was investigated properly, and we can feel safer with the results of that (hypothetical) investigate. There was an incident with a couple dogs earlier in the year (one dead, the other severely injured), the squirrels aren't the first incident. Pay attention, act responsibly.
The squirrels were too decomposed to determine the cause of death. "Lowly squirrels"????? I don't see squirrels killing other animals for no reason. We need a wild life organisation as part of RIOC to manage the wild life here. I am sure I am not the only one who miss seeing those darling animals on the lawns which now look like a ghost town.
Wow, no wonder hardly anybody wants to discuss issues with you anymore.
According to the zoologist Zach Zukenfort the squirrels died from climate change instead of other means. Check his article in the New Zoology. Also we are so fortunate to have you on Roosevelt Island because you are so knowing. I hang on every word you write.I consider you the Island Educator. Even though I find your writing so boring I think you do the island a great service. Keep up the good work even though people may not be listening to you.zzzzzzzzzzz
In his "The saving of humanity" the Italian philosopher Claudio Di Claudio wrote "death to all rodents". We must realise that Claudio wrote in the 14th century when the Bubonic Plague was rampant in Europe. According to some statics the Bubonic Plague killed 25 million people. While we all love our squirrels and don`t want any harm coming to them there are cases in the United States where squirrels were found carrying the Bubonic Plague. That is why the health authorities encourage us not to feed our squirrels. Reducing squirrel population is the goal according to the health authorities. Perhaps someone with Far Rants could add to the conversation. That is Far away Rants.
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